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Thread Author: 1983parrothead
Thread ID: 3051
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There are 16 posts in this thread, and it has been viewed 4390 times.
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Games you like that most people dislike.
1983parrothead
This topic is about discussing games that you disagree about being considered one of the worst (if not the worst).

One game I like that many others dislike is Survival Arts. Although the concept was influenced by Mortal Kombat, the way deaths are performed in Survival Arts are similar to the KOs in the gladiator mode of the 1984 Great Swordsman and especially the decapitations of both the 1987 Barbarian for the C64 and the 1989 Reikai Doushi, all three predating MK's release. MK's death moves are also based on the hidden moves idea that started in Brian Jacks Uchi Mata.

Survival Arts is far from being one of the worst fighting games, especially when you practice playing it, but if Sammy and Scarab spent more time with it like Visco did to Breakers and its successor Breakers Revenge, it probably would of been as good as (if not better than) Visco's fighting game. If you played SFII and MK before this, your opinion about it is like "It's different, now it sucks!", while you'll leave.

Characters may look so awful that Sammy and Scarab look like they used easy-to-find costumes from party shops, but they make me think they are generic characters that came out of action films in the late '80s, especially when you listen to the game's BGM while looking at them. Tasha might look like a rip-off of either Kitana, Mileena or Jade, but both MKII and SA were in development at the same time.

Survival Arts and Martial Champion have a lot in common: both developers' first attempts after the success of SFII, unique weapon features, large sprites, two female characters instead of one (both including an American blue-eyed kunoichi, or ninja girl, which are Rachael and Tasha), vertically scrollable stages (high jumps?) and final bosses that have one special move of each character combined into the boss' move sets.
Edited by 1983parrothead on 03. January 2011 00:02
 
merlin
I have played Survival Arts but I never really enjoyed it I'm afraid Parrothead. The characters don't appeal to me very much and also the gameplay has an overall 'clunky' feel to it. I do know a few people who are also fans of the game. It does seem to have a bit of a following.

One game I like that seems to be hated by nearly everyone is Ragnagard on the Neo Geo. Obviously there are far better fighting games on the Neo but this game really doesn't deserve all the hate directed towards it. Although a bit pixellated the graphics do look quite nice with some great looking backgrounds especially for the stages of Benten, Igret and Eelis. The sprite animation is very fluid when the characters are standing still but unfortunately rather stiff at other times. Character designs are varied and interesting too. The game has a fair amount of depth to it and the ability to fight very high up in the air makes this game unique amongst Neo Geo fighters. You can pull off some pretty crazy stuff once you know what you're doing like mid air combos. The music in this game is excellent.
 
RiKo
ive never played any of those games, but ive always liked the DOA (2 and onwards) games up to a point. i know they arent up there with the best but they are pretty good games really. its a different style of fighting with all the reversals. At one time people were saying they were future of fighting games because you had multi-layered fighting arenas and there were lot of interactions - such as throwing people into cars/animals or off buildings. i think maybe if they reworked the formula and graphics style a bit they could come up with something special.

i cant think of any other ones really
Mini-Reviews of films I have just watched : http://richwatmov...press.com/
Mini-Reviews of ZX Spectrum games : https://iplayzxsp...ress.com//
 
http://www.youtube.com/user/PhoenixRisen7
Glowsquid
Ghen War - This is perhaps one of the most underrated genre-changer of all time. This was a FPS that had fully 3D environment and enemies almost a full year before Quake, complex level geometry, extensive deformable terrain, music that changes depending on what is happening... ect, and it's still unique in some ways, like how you're playing as a mech that can move and rotate its torso independently.

Being a American 3D game on the Saturn, it's not exactly a fan favorite. But I think it's good.

Slave Zero - The Dreamcast version is a pretty mediocre port, but I don't get the hate this game gets. The gameplay is smooth, the bosses are cool and innovative, the guns are fun... ect. It's just a fun mindless gameé
 
STE C
Aye I always thought Slave Zero got some unfair stick, in fact a lot of really good Dreamcast games seemed to suffer the same negative press.
 
CrazyDiamond
The Punisher for the NES. I can't understand why this game gets so many bad reviews, because I loved it back then, and I still enjoy playing it today when I'm in the mood for it. Great Dynamite Duke-type of game.
 
NeoGeoNinja
POTENTIALLY...
I could be here all day with this, especially seeing as I'm a fan of BOTH the Atari Jaguar and 3DO - both consoles that get stick from people who have NEVER even played any of the games on it!

Most recently, I have discovered that MANY ppl dislike the original Red Steel for the Wii. I also fancied playing it myself, so now all the dust has cleared, I grabbed myself a copy on the cheap.

Predictably, and in a perfectly clichéd manner: "I don't see why ppl dislike this game so much?". Seriously though, it's actually very polished indeed and great fun. It was after all, a launch title for the Wii and the consoles first ever foray into the Wii-Pointer FPS genre. And for a first attempt, it is VERY good indeed. It's NOT perfect, and there are some teething issues here and there (the one on one sword fighting bits can be frustrating at times, as it requires to much accuracy and thought) but the actual run and gunning is great. Again, it has been severely refined since, but with a little tolerance, the game is awesome! I've enjoyed it thoroughly thus far...

Ninja
i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv359/NeoGeoNinja/NGNsignatureRev1.jpg
 
shion
Pit Fighter

That game kicks some serious ass
 
http://www.gamefaqs.com/users/1stTobalMan/contribu
The eccentric cat
Shinobi (PS2), I adore the gameplay and soundtrack, but it gets crud reviews because of the difficulty. Its not as difficult as most people put it, really. :(
Without love, the truth cannot be seen.
 
reelmojo
Golden Axe Beast Rider. Critics have complained about a fighting system that rewards inaction which just means it's beneficial to wait for your opponents to attack first so that you can counterattack. This same gameplay mechanic was later praised in Batman Arkham Asylum and Castlevania: Lords of Shadow. They also complain that there's not enough exploration... because for some reason they think Golden Axe should be Tomb Raider now. I also hear a lot of bitching that the beasts are slow and plodding so apparently next time Sega should make creatures the size of elephants move with the speed of a cheetah. I even read a review by a very popular source that said pressing the counter attack or parry buttons doesn't interrupt your attack which is just 100% false! So why don't people like the game? I guess they just wanted something else. The only knock I have against it is that there's no coop.

And Riko, I'm a fan of the DOA games too. And as far as 3D fighters go I do think they're up there with the best. In fact I'm very interested to see what Team Ninja does with the series without Itagaki, and to see what he does if he decides to make a new fighting game without being forced to work within the confines of a pre-existing series.
 
STE C
This is a pretty obscure game but I really like this obscure Jap MD shooter from 1990 which the UK gaming mags really layed into at the time, I recall one MD mag listed it as the worst game of all time. It is in my eyes an unusual but fun shooter with some unique graphics and enemies, the box art is also very erm unusual but I really like it.

http://en.wikiped...eo_game%29

Daikatana , yeah the $40 million big budget FPS from 2000 , John Romeros 4 year in the waiting baby that got crucified in the press. Yet I found it to be a very enjoyable FPS with some great ( yet buggy) ideas. Some of the graphics later in the game were amazing but the awful early levels really f*cked up what should have been one the the decades best games.

http://en.wikiped.../Daikatana
 
1983parrothead
Check this out. I've never played it, but I remember seeing this game criticized even by G4 Tech TV's Filter:

YouTube Video


merlin wrote:
I have played Survival Arts but I never really enjoyed it I'm afraid Parrothead. The characters don't appeal to me very much and also the gameplay has an overall 'clunky' feel to it. I do know a few people who are also fans of the game. It does seem to have a bit of a following.

One game I like that seems to be hated by nearly everyone is Ragnagard on the Neo Geo. Obviously there are far better fighting games on the Neo but this game really doesn't deserve all the hate directed towards it. Although a bit pixellated the graphics do look quite nice with some great looking backgrounds especially for the stages of Benten, Igret and Eelis. The sprite animation is very fluid when the characters are standing still but unfortunately rather stiff at other times. Character designs are varied and interesting too. The game has a fair amount of depth to it and the ability to fight very high up in the air makes this game unique amongst Neo Geo fighters. You can pull off some pretty crazy stuff once you know what you're doing like mid air combos. The music in this game is excellent.


Compared to Survival Arts, the farthest I've ever got in Ragnagard was to Behemoth, the first of the three bosses, while I got to Dantel in Survival Arts. It's harder for me to perform combos in Ragnagard than in Survival Arts, but compare Gen's Ragnagard combo video to Plexosolarasolas' "Survival Arts Essai". Plexosolarasolas also uploaded his own Ragnagard combo video without tool-assistance. And unlike Survival Arts, Ragnagard was ported to a few consoles, even recently to the Wii Virtual Console in Japan. However, Survival Arts was planned for release on the MD / GEN, but canceled.


But I will tell you more detailed reasons why Survival Arts isn't as bad as most people say.

Survival Arts might suck to North American and European gamers, but I assume it's a cult classic to some gamers in Japan, because |1.| it was mentioned in this Japanese page of (cult classic?) fighting games, |2.| I saw tournament videos of similar fighting games like these tournament videos of Jackie Chan in Fists of Fire: Jackie Chan Densetsu and this tournament video of a similar fighting game Blood Warrior featuring the well known GGXX pro gamer Pachi, and |3.| a M.U.G.E.N contributor from Japan name "Mass" is beginning to convert Survival Arts characters.

Plexosolarasolas said that the game had a decent reception in his home region Chile, though it had a short lifespan there. Of course it is influenced by MK, but innovation isn't always necessary; it only needs to be enjoyable by certain tastes. Taito's Dino Rex is more innovative than Atari Games' Primal Rage, but most people prefer Primal Rage. Tekken and Dead or Alive aren't as innovative as Virtua Fighter, but I usually hear most American gamers prefer Dead or Alive and especially Tekken over Virtua Fighter. MK isn't even the first to feature it's best known features. But what makes a good game? Fun factor? No, that's too subjective. "Good" is part of the opinion.

For the graphics and designs, if you like digitized sprites more than blood and gore, then SA might be your pick. The digitized sprites were the largest back then and are probably one of the largest (if not the largest) today. Konami's Martial Champion also had large sprites the same year. The frame rates are smoother on some characters than the ones in MK1, but probably the same as in MK2 (which was released a month later). The characters and settings remind me of the styles of action films from the mid to late '80s like Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome and Terminator, while the machinery stage kind of reminds me of the final scenes of both Arnold Schwarzenegger films Commando, Terminator and Terminator 2: Judgement Day. MK1 had a Enter The Dragon style, while later MK titles became darker and darker. Some gamers said something like "the live actors look like their wearing cheap costumes straight out of Party City-like stores", but I never thought anything like that. I thought they looked okay. Tasha isn't a rip-off of Kitana nor Mileena, because SA was in development at the same time as MK2 and was released a month before MK2. During the same year, another kunoichi (female ninja) Rachael was created for Konami's Martial Champion. Hiryu seems more faithful to real ninjas than MK's ninjas. For the move sets, some are original and some were slightly different versions of moves from other fighting games.

For the features, having multiple weapons to pick up in a 2D plane field hasn't been done before. Atari Games' Pit-Fighter had multiple weapons, but in a 3D plane field. Dino Rex had only bones to pick up. Martial Champion had multiple weapons to pick up, but only when you knock down certain opponents. This idea was later popularized by the Super Smash Bros. series, but the "No items; Fox only; Final Destination" preference makes weapons not-so important to the preferences of fighting game fans. Perhaps the most innovative feature is the ability to end combos with a death move, making it a precursor to the "Brutalities" from MK3, which can be proven in the "Survival Arts Essai" video.

For the audio, with the exception of Dantel's stage theme, the BGM may sound generic and forgettable, but it kind of gives it the same feeling as hearing drones/atmospheres/new age BGM in film scores (like the films I said before). For the sound effects, they kind of sound realistic. If they were too realistic, they might also be loud enough to scare some bystanders to the cabinet.

And now for the most important part: the gameplay. In my opinion, after hearing numerous gamers criticizing against Survival Arts while the Japanese webpage above said to readers "Please come out (to the arcades) and play it.", I've decided to play it, but in MAME and at first, the controls were responsive, but the game felt as difficult as when I first played the SNES port of SFII World Warrior as a kid, but then I practiced playing Survival Arts and was able to play it well. I heard the character roster isn't balanced well, but I heard some say that the MK series isn't well balanced either (correct me if I'm incorrect), but MK fans didn't care if it has to be balanced. After seeing the combo video, the 100% combos might be one of the game's cons, but Toukidensho Angel Eyes' combos are like that too, and I usually hear more people liking that fighting game by Tecmo. Tecmo's fighting game was also mentioned in the same Japanese website above. If SA doesn't exactly play like SFII nor MK to you, then it's probably trying to be different.

The voice acting is sometimes annoying, and sometimes enjoyable. One thing I really dislike the most in Survival Arts is the final boss Dantel. I wanted to beat him using Viper first, but he is harder than Dio from World Heroes 2, which I beat one time in Death Match Mode and two times in Normal Mode.

To wrap things up, I did play MK 1 and 2 back when they were popular, but only on 16-bit consoles, and I kind of enjoyed them. My brother even got MK2 for SNES and told me that Santa dropped it. I lost it with my other 16-bit gear 12 years ago during my moving from one house to another. I do like both the MK series and SA, but I don't play either one as much as studying and researching video game information, due to certain reasons by my parents.
Edited by 1983parrothead on 28. January 2012 04:32
 
CrazyDiamond
Superman for the Genesis. I don't know why people hate this game so much, because I haven't found anything not to like about it. People who bash the game also say you can't jump, which is not true, because you can. It's also one of the only few Superman games I know that's actually decent (the other two being the arcade game by Taito and The Death and Return of Superman). And people also say it's too hard. Challenging, yes, but they make it sound like the game is impossible. Well I think it's a pretty damn good challenge for a game that only has 4 levels.
 
Murikov
I might give Survival Arts a try, I quite like cheesy not-so-serious Arcade brawlers (with Blood Warrior being my favorite example). Smile

A game killed by critics and loved by me was Shellshock Nam '67 released by Guerilla in 2004 (the same team behind the Killzone trilogy). Having a soft spot for Vietnam FPS/TPS I always liked Shellshock's presentation of gore, dirt and pseudo-realism. It gave the game a different touch unlike most other games of the genre. Never as good as 'Vietcong', but it still remains as a special game in my personal Gaming history.

YouTube Video


The recently released sequel on the other hand really sucked from what I've heard so far. It was practically a completely new game (a zombie-horror-FPS) and had absolutely nothing to do with the predecessor, except for having the Vietnam scenario as well.
i.imgur.com/aLu1k0m.gif
 
merlin
1983parrothead wrote:
Check this out. I've never played it, but I remember seeing this game criticized even by G4 Tech TV's Filter:

YouTube Video



That was very amusing Parrothead. Derek Alexander is my favourite Youtube reviewer but I somehow missed that video. His commentary was pretty funny and I liked the bit with Lucy Liu dancing in a strange way! Grin I've also never met anyone called Algar.

As for Survival Arts although like you say it does have weapons that can be picked up and
scope for combos it's not a game that I find enjoyable. You're obviously very passionate about the game Parrothead and I'm glad you and quite a few others enjoy the game so much.

One game I could mention in this topic is Golden Axe The Duel. Over time this has become one of my favourite fighting games yet surprisingly quite a few people regard it as being really bad. I just love the character designs, artwork, music and the gameplay, although not particularly deep, is fun. The screen filling super moves are always impressive to behold.
 
candycab
I think you are right about Golden Axe Merlin, I have never liked any of them very much. I have always felt the GA games were a let down as their sluggish movement and collision detection are some of the worst too ever come out of a Sega game and I have never been willing to accept shit controls etc on any game in order to like it. Much as I do/did like Sega there were a few games of that period that I never found an ounce of fun in while others raved about them.

Altered Beast and Space Harrier are another Two that were/are way over rated as well imho.

Graphically I can see why people like Space Harrier but to this day I find it's game play is still as boring as ever for me. Kinda blows but that's just how it is Shrug


Hmm on topic pretty much 90% of the games released on the 3DO fits Grin

I think the arcade version of A.P.B. probably fits too as I have only ran into a handful of people who actually know what it is let alone like the game.

I liked it enough to run down a super clean example back in 1991 and make that the first machine I ever bought. I will literally be taking that 500Lb beast with me to my grave since my last wishes are to be cremated and placed inside it Grin

If I think of anything obscure I will post it up.
Edited by candycab on 03. February 2012 00:21
I spent most of the eighties, most of my life, riding around in somebody else's car, in possession of, or ingested of, something illegal, on my way from something illegal to something illegal with many illegal things happening all around me.

James Newell Osterberg, Jr


"Last screw is hidden under a warranty-voiding sticker. Darn, cant return this thing to the store - guess Ill just have to make a laptop out of it!"

Ben Heck on PS3 Slim
 
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